74.251.40.200 (talk) Cheyene |
Aboutmovies (talk | contribs) m Reverted edits by 74.251.40.200 (talk) to last version by Simesa |
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{{AfricaProject | class=C|importance=|Liberia=yes|Liberia-importance=High}} |
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By:Cheyene Anderson: |
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{{WP1.0|v0.7=fail|class=C|category=History}} |
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==Neither Here Nor There== |
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In the external links, why is there the excess backstory about the Institute for Historical Review? Without disputing the facts of what is being said about them, what exactly does their position on the Holocaust have to do with the price of eggs in this case? It's totally irrelevant to the topic at hand, not to mention the content linked to, and probably has no place in this entry. |
In the external links, why is there the excess backstory about the Institute for Historical Review? Without disputing the facts of what is being said about them, what exactly does their position on the Holocaust have to do with the price of eggs in this case? It's totally irrelevant to the topic at hand, not to mention the content linked to, and probably has no place in this entry. |
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Besides which, if we're going to make it standard wikipedia practice to mention every time someone links to an article on the internet by an author or group called anti-semitic by somebody or other, we're going to need to do a major revision of 90% of the external links. |
Besides which, if we're going to make it standard wikipedia practice to mention every time someone links to an article on the internet by an author or group called anti-semitic by somebody or other, we're going to need to do a major revision of 90% of the external links. |
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January 16th, 2005, 11:53 A.M. GMT. |
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Corrections made to the article include the name of the man who founded the organization, Robert Finley, (not Robert Finlay). |
Corrections made to the article include the name of the man who founded the organization, Robert Finley, (not Robert Finlay). |
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References to "black Americans" were changed to the accurate term, which is "free Negroes," who were not Americans since they could not vote. |
References to "black Americans" were changed to the accurate term, which is "free Negroes," who were not Americans since they could not vote. |
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The National Colonization Society of America was founded in 1816. Some free Negroes had departed the United States voluntarily prior to 1816, which indicates that the United States was a hotbed of racial hatred in the quarter-century from 1790-1815. It is possible that an earlier Colonization Society called the American Colonization Society existed prior to 1816. Sierre Leone was created in Africa some two to four decades before Liberia was created. |
The National Colonization Society of America was founded in 1816. Some free Negroes had departed the United States voluntarily prior to 1816, which indicates that the United States was a hotbed of racial hatred in the quarter-century from 1790-1815. It is possible that an earlier Colonization Society called the American Colonization Society existed prior to 1816. Sierre Leone was created in Africa some two to four decades before Liberia was created. |
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It is likely that the article still contains some statements which are either far-fetched or untrue. |
It is likely that the article still contains some statements which are either far-fetched or untrue. |
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:What is the new word for what one used to called "American women" who were not Americans since they could not vote? We count on everyone to actively improve any statements which are either far-fetched or untrue. |
:What is the new word for what one used to called "American women" who were not Americans since they could not vote? We count on everyone to actively improve any statements which are either far-fetched or untrue. --[[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 19:16, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) |
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I have access to a big, fat encyclopedia that states that James Madison (but not James Monroe) was one of the Presidents of the National Colonization Society. President Washington's nephew, Bushrod Washington was a President at one time (and the owner of Mount Vernon, George Washington's mansion). |
I have access to a big, fat encyclopedia that states that James Madison (but not James Monroe) was one of the Presidents of the National Colonization Society. President Washington's nephew, Bushrod Washington was a President at one time (and the owner of Mount Vernon, George Washington's mansion). |
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By the way, white women were Americans because the head of the family voted for himself, his wife, and his children. |
By the way, white women were Americans because the head of the family voted for himself, his wife, and his children. |
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There is a big difference between being deported (by force) and being transported (voluntarily) away. |
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January 17th, 2005 10:13 P.M. GMT |
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==It is too complex== |
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The subject of establishing [[free Negroes]] in some other place is too complex for a Wikipedia article. Books were written about the subject in the 19th century. Some men devoted much of their lives to the effort. |
The subject of establishing [[free Negroes]] in some other place is too complex for a Wikipedia article. Books were written about the subject in the 19th century. Some men devoted much of their lives to the effort. |
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EXAMPLE; The nation's most radical Abolitionist, [[William Lloyd Garrison]] (1805-79), was an advocate of immediate [[Manumission|emancipation]] on the soil (freed slaves would remain here). Garrison's friend, [[Benjamin Lundy]] (1789-1839), favored the colonization of freed slaves to places such as [[Haiti]] and [[Mexico]]. In 1838, a mob burned Pennsylvania Hall in [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]], destroying nearly all of his possessions. The action of that mob proved that many despisers of colonization existed in 1838, when the President of the United States was a [[Pro-slavery Democrat]] named Martin Van Buren, of the State of New York. |
EXAMPLE; The nation's most radical Abolitionist, [[William Lloyd Garrison]] (1805-79), was an advocate of immediate [[Manumission|emancipation]] on the soil (freed slaves would remain here). Garrison's friend, [[Benjamin Lundy]] (1789-1839), favored the colonization of freed slaves to places such as [[Haiti]] and [[Mexico]]. In 1838, a mob burned Pennsylvania Hall in [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]], destroying nearly all of his possessions. The action of that mob proved that many despisers of colonization existed in 1838, when the President of the United States was a [[Pro-slavery Democrat]] named Martin Van Buren, of the State of New York. |
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A big, fat encyclopedia could be written on the subject. |
A big, fat encyclopedia could be written on the subject. |
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It all boils down to the following sentences. In the [[Roman Empire]], Romans allowed the existence of an ''Imperium in imperio'' which is "a power within a power" or ""an empire within an empire" or "a state within a state," but the American empire builders scorned that notion. U.S. President [[Abraham Lincoln]] claimed that the United States was a "tree that should not have a crows' nest in it. |
It all boils down to the following sentences. In the [[Roman Empire]], Romans allowed the existence of an ''Imperium in imperio'' which is "a power within a power" or ""an empire within an empire" or "a state within a state," but the American empire builders scorned that notion. U.S. President [[Abraham Lincoln]] claimed that the United States was a "tree that should not have a crows' nest in it." |
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2:22 A.M. GMT January 27th, 2005 |
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== Original research moved to talk - source needed == |
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Taken in the context of the previous quotes, Lincoln, ever the master diplomat, may have been seeking to placate the emancipated slave population with this overture while he waited for General Butler to report back to him on the feasibility of colonization. Regardless of the intent of Lincoln's proclamtion, like the issue of slavery, he knew that his suggestions could either be accepted or rejected by the States and as such he respected their sovereignty by leaving the issue of suffrage ultimately up to them, as was the case in his instructions for the reconstruction of the State of Louisiana. |
Taken in the context of the previous quotes, Lincoln, ever the master diplomat, may have been seeking to placate the emancipated slave population with this overture while he waited for General Butler to report back to him on the feasibility of colonization. Regardless of the intent of Lincoln's proclamtion, like the issue of slavery, he knew that his suggestions could either be accepted or rejected by the States and as such he respected their sovereignty by leaving the issue of suffrage ultimately up to them, as was the case in his instructions for the reconstruction of the State of Louisiana. |
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==Ugh== |
==Ugh== |
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The usages of multiple new terms such as "free blacks" and "African Americans" ruined the article. The people were called Free Negroes. Also, slaveowners remarked that Negroes were "docile" and that white men were "hostile" and not suited to slavery. "Indigent whites" is a novel expression. White men could purchase 80 acres of land in [[Ohio]] for one hundred dollars. Land in Ohio sold for a dollar and a quarter per acre, thus 400 acres (161.9 hectares) of land in Ohio costed 500 dollars. I had never heard of "indigent whites" in the United States until after Wikipedia was invented. Distortions of historical truths are placed in Wikipedia every day. "Indigent whites" appears to be a creation by a mythifier. |
The usages of multiple new terms such as "free blacks" and "African Americans" ruined the article. The people were called Free Negroes. Also, slaveowners remarked that Negroes were "docile" and that white men were "hostile" and not suited to slavery. "Indigent whites" is a novel expression. White men could purchase 80 acres of land in [[Ohio]] for one hundred dollars. Land in Ohio sold for a dollar and a quarter per acre, thus 400 acres (161.9 hectares) of land in Ohio costed 500 dollars. I had never heard of "indigent whites" in the United States until after Wikipedia was invented. Distortions of historical truths are placed in Wikipedia every day. "Indigent whites" appears to be a creation by a mythifier.[[User:HeyYallYo|HeyYallYo]] 02:12, 27 August 2007 (UTC) |
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Are you saying there weren't any poor white people in the United States at that time? |
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Are you saying there weren't any poor white people in the United States at that time? <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/128.61.76.170|128.61.76.170]] ([[User talk:128.61.76.170|talk]]) 19:52, 15 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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==12 years old Wikipedians== |
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== Last section reads like a high school persuasive writing assignment == |
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This "assessment" only has one source citation to support incredibly sweeping claims about the effectiveness of the American Colonization Society which MUST be supported by facts. Also, the last paragraph should be deleted because it's far too editorialized for an enclyclopedia article, i.e. "America, not Africa, was their home and they had little desire to migrate to a strange and forbidding land to achieve someone else's dream." Save that for a 9th grade persuasive writing assignment, not for a fair encyclopedia article for the world to see. |
This "assessment" only has one source citation to support incredibly sweeping claims about the effectiveness of the American Colonization Society which MUST be supported by facts. Also, the last paragraph should be deleted because it's far too editorialized for an enclyclopedia article, i.e. "America, not Africa, was their home and they had little desire to migrate to a strange and forbidding land to achieve someone else's dream." Save that for a 9th grade persuasive writing assignment, not for a fair encyclopedia article for the world to see. |
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== Ethnic cleansing == |
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⚫ | It is fairly clear to me that the ACS was something that would be called an ethnic cleansing organization today. I think that it would be fair to name it so descriptively (but not pejoratively). There seems to be an awful lot of historical sensitivity to the ACS, up to and beyond the point where such sensitivity blends over into whitewash. I don't think that whitewash is ever NPOV. |
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I thank thes is stuped |
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⚫ | It is fairly clear to me that the ACS was something that would be called an ethnic cleansing organization today. I think that it would be fair to name it so descriptively (but not pejoratively). There seems to be an awful lot of historical sensitivity to the ACS, up to and beyond the point where such sensitivity blends over into whitewash. I don't think that whitewash is ever NPOV. [[User:TMLutas|TMLutas]] ([[User talk:TMLutas|talk]]) 20:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC) |
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and i do not like wut the winet did to the blak that is men.[[by |
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the dern that are so stuped and I do not like my report.]]And you for you time and the time I end 6:29.And the time started 6:00. |
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== Version 0.7 == |
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I can accept the importance of the topic, but this article has too many cleanup tags and negative Talk page comments to be usable for Version 0.7. If it can be cleaned up to B, with the cleanup/POV issues addressed, it would be a good choice for the next release. Thanks, [[User:Walkerma|Walkerma]] ([[User talk:Walkerma|talk]]) 07:53, 10 November 2008 (UTC) |
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==PBS documentary== |
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There's a PBS documentary that disagrees with key dates in this article. [http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part3/3p1521.html PBS documentary] [[User:Simesa|Simesa]] ([[User talk:Simesa|talk]]) 07:58, 27 January 2009 (UTC) |
Revision as of 03:34, 25 February 2009
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to this page and add the quality rating to that template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details.![]() | Africa: Liberia C‑class | ||||||||||||
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Neither Here Nor There
In the external links, why is there the excess backstory about the Institute for Historical Review? Without disputing the facts of what is being said about them, what exactly does their position on the Holocaust have to do with the price of eggs in this case? It's totally irrelevant to the topic at hand, not to mention the content linked to, and probably has no place in this entry.
Besides which, if we're going to make it standard wikipedia practice to mention every time someone links to an article on the internet by an author or group called anti-semitic by somebody or other, we're going to need to do a major revision of 90% of the external links.
January 16th, 2005, 11:53 A.M. GMT.
Corrections made to the article include the name of the man who founded the organization, Robert Finley, (not Robert Finlay).
References to "black Americans" were changed to the accurate term, which is "free Negroes," who were not Americans since they could not vote.
The National Colonization Society of America was founded in 1816. Some free Negroes had departed the United States voluntarily prior to 1816, which indicates that the United States was a hotbed of racial hatred in the quarter-century from 1790-1815. It is possible that an earlier Colonization Society called the American Colonization Society existed prior to 1816. Sierre Leone was created in Africa some two to four decades before Liberia was created.
The references to "blacks" should be removed. Free Negroes were called "colored" in the census reports of 1790, 1800, 1810, 1820, etc.
It is likely that the article still contains some statements which are either far-fetched or untrue.
- What is the new word for what one used to called "American women" who were not Americans since they could not vote? We count on everyone to actively improve any statements which are either far-fetched or untrue. --Wetman 19:16, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
How many encyclopedia articles about Shakespeare use only the language of his time?--JimWae 18:49, 2005 Jan 16 (UTC)
I have access to a big, fat encyclopedia that states that James Madison (but not James Monroe) was one of the Presidents of the National Colonization Society. President Washington's nephew, Bushrod Washington was a President at one time (and the owner of Mount Vernon, George Washington's mansion).
The copyright laws of the United states have been extended from the original 14 years to 95 years, today. It is illegal for Americans to utilize copyrighted items in great detail. The "Fair Use" provision of the law offers a little bit of protection.
The big, fat encyclopedia will be made available in the next ten years by Google which is making copies of numerous books. I have already employed the big, fat encyclopedia as the source of the name and the information about Robert Finley, sketchily. I hope that I haven't exceeded the "Fair Use" rule.
By the way, white women were Americans because the head of the family voted for himself, his wife, and his children.
There is a big difference between being deported (by force) and being transported (voluntarily) away.
January 17th, 2005 10:13 P.M. GMT
It is too complex
The subject of establishing free Negroes in some other place is too complex for a Wikipedia article. Books were written about the subject in the 19th century. Some men devoted much of their lives to the effort.
EXAMPLE; The nation's most radical Abolitionist, William Lloyd Garrison (1805-79), was an advocate of immediate emancipation on the soil (freed slaves would remain here). Garrison's friend, Benjamin Lundy (1789-1839), favored the colonization of freed slaves to places such as Haiti and Mexico. In 1838, a mob burned Pennsylvania Hall in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, destroying nearly all of his possessions. The action of that mob proved that many despisers of colonization existed in 1838, when the President of the United States was a Pro-slavery Democrat named Martin Van Buren, of the State of New York.
A big, fat encyclopedia could be written on the subject.
It all boils down to the following sentences. In the Roman Empire, Romans allowed the existence of an Imperium in imperio which is "a power within a power" or ""an empire within an empire" or "a state within a state," but the American empire builders scorned that notion. U.S. President Abraham Lincoln claimed that the United States was a "tree that should not have a crows' nest in it."
2:22 A.M. GMT January 27th, 2005
Original research moved to talk - source needed
Taken in the context of the previous quotes, Lincoln, ever the master diplomat, may have been seeking to placate the emancipated slave population with this overture while he waited for General Butler to report back to him on the feasibility of colonization. Regardless of the intent of Lincoln's proclamtion, like the issue of slavery, he knew that his suggestions could either be accepted or rejected by the States and as such he respected their sovereignty by leaving the issue of suffrage ultimately up to them, as was the case in his instructions for the reconstruction of the State of Louisiana.
Ugh
The usages of multiple new terms such as "free blacks" and "African Americans" ruined the article. The people were called Free Negroes. Also, slaveowners remarked that Negroes were "docile" and that white men were "hostile" and not suited to slavery. "Indigent whites" is a novel expression. White men could purchase 80 acres of land in Ohio for one hundred dollars. Land in Ohio sold for a dollar and a quarter per acre, thus 400 acres (161.9 hectares) of land in Ohio costed 500 dollars. I had never heard of "indigent whites" in the United States until after Wikipedia was invented. Distortions of historical truths are placed in Wikipedia every day. "Indigent whites" appears to be a creation by a mythifier.HeyYallYo 02:12, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Are you saying there weren't any poor white people in the United States at that time? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.61.76.170 (talk) 19:52, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
12 years old Wikipedians
Keep it in mind that a term such as "indigent whites" may be the creation of a 12-years-old individual. Wikipedia does not prevent 12 years old Wikipedians from contributing their thoughts.HeyYallYo 11:04, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Last section reads like a high school persuasive writing assignment
This "assessment" only has one source citation to support incredibly sweeping claims about the effectiveness of the American Colonization Society which MUST be supported by facts. Also, the last paragraph should be deleted because it's far too editorialized for an enclyclopedia article, i.e. "America, not Africa, was their home and they had little desire to migrate to a strange and forbidding land to achieve someone else's dream." Save that for a 9th grade persuasive writing assignment, not for a fair encyclopedia article for the world to see.
Ethnic cleansing
It is fairly clear to me that the ACS was something that would be called an ethnic cleansing organization today. I think that it would be fair to name it so descriptively (but not pejoratively). There seems to be an awful lot of historical sensitivity to the ACS, up to and beyond the point where such sensitivity blends over into whitewash. I don't think that whitewash is ever NPOV. TMLutas (talk) 20:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Version 0.7
I can accept the importance of the topic, but this article has too many cleanup tags and negative Talk page comments to be usable for Version 0.7. If it can be cleaned up to B, with the cleanup/POV issues addressed, it would be a good choice for the next release. Thanks, Walkerma (talk) 07:53, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
PBS documentary
There's a PBS documentary that disagrees with key dates in this article. PBS documentary Simesa (talk) 07:58, 27 January 2009 (UTC)