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Semi-protected edit request on 24 April 2023
There Is a mistake!
Aristotle didn't believe that Plato created Atlantic I hope look at this I was want to add link but it's not allowed حمزة للنواصره (talk) 21:20, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
It’s not fictional.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Atlantis actually existed. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:22, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I think you will need to find some top-line RS to back up this claim. Slatersteven (talk) 17:25, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I’m a historian. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk)
- 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:31, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Then you're used to needing to cite sources. Let's see them. MrOllie (talk) 17:32, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- This is real evidence.
- https://greekreporter.com/2022/12/10/atlantis-plato-history-real/
- 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:35, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- This is not a peer-reviewed academic journal. Slatersteven (talk) 17:41, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- That's an advert for a book from a vanity publisher, written by the book's author and posted on an unreliable website. At minimum we'd need something peer-reviewed, as Slatersteven says. As a historian you should be familiar with academic publishing and what sorts of journals publish peer-reviewed articles. MrOllie (talk) 17:45, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I don’t have to. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:20, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Please read wp:v and wp:or. Slatersteven (talk) 17:34, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/amp/ncna1055856 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:48, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- This is not platos Atlantis (it is using "Atlantis" to mean sunken land), and is not Santorini either. Slatersteven (talk) 17:51, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Atlantis is real, please believe me. I’ve written a book on it. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:55, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- It's not that we don't believe you, it's that we don't believe anyone. Wikipedia follows the best available sources per WP:V and WP:NOR. When you can support with peer-reviewed journals, feel free to come back. Until then there's nothing we can do here. MrOllie (talk) 18:04, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- We also already mentioned Santorini, it is one of many "real atlantasses". Yours is just the latest version of an idea that is 60 years old. Slatersteven (talk) 18:06, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- You’re wrong. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 19:40, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- ok MrOllie (talk) 19:50, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Just “ok?” 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:17, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Yes. You know what you have to provide to change the article. There is nothing more to discuss. MrOllie (talk) 20:18, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- What do I need to provide? 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:21, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I’ll just change it from fiction to non-fiction when I get semi-protection editing rights. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:23, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- No, you won't be allowed to change the article without proper sourcing. This has been explained above, more than once. Feel free to re-read the discussion, I'm not going to keep repeating myself. MrOllie (talk) 20:25, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- You’re an idiot then. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:27, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Why can’t it be changed? Can you explain it to me again? 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:31, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- No, the explanations stop when the personal attacks start. Have a good day. MrOllie (talk) 20:33, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I’m sorry for my actions. May I please have a second chance? 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:46, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- No, the explanations stop when the personal attacks start. Have a good day. MrOllie (talk) 20:33, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- No, you won't be allowed to change the article without proper sourcing. This has been explained above, more than once. Feel free to re-read the discussion, I'm not going to keep repeating myself. MrOllie (talk) 20:25, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Yes. You know what you have to provide to change the article. There is nothing more to discuss. MrOllie (talk) 20:18, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Just “ok?” 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 20:17, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- ok MrOllie (talk) 19:50, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- You’re wrong. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 19:40, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Atlantis is real, please believe me. I’ve written a book on it. 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:55, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- This is not platos Atlantis (it is using "Atlantis" to mean sunken land), and is not Santorini either. Slatersteven (talk) 17:51, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/amp/ncna1055856 2600:1005:B164:AC1A:9145:2171:1E7B:B3CF (talk) 17:48, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- Then you're used to needing to cite sources. Let's see them. MrOllie (talk) 17:32, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
Kodiak Island
Can we add a mention under location hypothesis of Kodiak Island as discussed in the following book:
https://archive.org/details/atlantis-and-its-fate-in-the-postdiluvian-world
Reasons:
1) Similarities between the Kircher Map of Atlantis and Kodiak Island during the Younger Dryas, and that Kodiak at that time fits many of Plato's dimensions.
2) Similarities between the "Aeletean" kings of Ancient Egypt, thought to have come from a faraway land, and the modern word "Aleutian". Other historians also imply there was a colony from India and the Far East south of Egypt in antiquity near "Punt" where the Ancient Egyptians believed their gods, the same ones aligned with the Aeletean kings, came from.
3) Sonar imaging of an underwater site southeast of Chirikof Island might imply a sunken human face monument and ruins that would put the pyramids at Giza to shame.
4) Genetic evidence of the X2 haplogroup in the Bayahira Oasis region of Egypt suggests a link to Native North Americans, suggesting Beringia as a possible origin point for Atlantis. The Berbers of North Africa also share a relative with the Sami circa 7,000 BCE, who would have been in Northern Siberia at the time. 47.32.37.155 (talk) 14:37, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- A self-published book isn't a reliable source. Schazjmd (talk) 14:39, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- "CHAPTER FIVE: ON UAP; € DETECTING TIME-DILATING PHENOMENA". ROFL. AndyTheGrump (talk) 14:53, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- And "CHAPTER SIX: ON TIME TRAVEL" shows a rather weak grasp of physics. Donald Albury 16:03, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
I think we can leave out reviews, this is not a forum. Slatersteven (talk) 16:23, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Evaluating potential sources is a legitimate use of article talk pages, and using the ridiculous chapter titles to show why we aren't going to cite this nonsense saves a lot of unnecessary waffle. AndyTheGrump (talk) 17:26, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
Where us your evidence that its fiction then?
Plato never wrote a single piece of fiction and there is 0 evidence to support this claim. Its pure speculation, you should be clear about the controversy instead of starting with "its fiction". Even if you feel strongly, its wrong to do that. 72.48.43.29 (talk) 22:42, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
- Please see Talk:Atlantis/Archive 7#Rfc: Atlantis as Fiction, Allegory. Deor (talk) 00:28, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
- Or, we go by what RS say. Slatersteven (talk) 12:52, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
- Plato also didn't write factual history. He was a philosopher; his works contain many so-called "Platonian myths" that are meant to illustrate various philosophical arguments (e.g., Ring of Gyges), but are not to be understood as historiography in the sense of Herodotus. --bender235 (talk) 05:11, 29 October 2023 (UTC)